Woodwares closing / Sainsburys coming to Portobello

[gillian]

The only people who should be worried about this is Scotmid. ... and the staff are a complete joke ...

I must be going to a different shop, or have a different attitude, I think the staff, on the whole are helpful and friendly.

[urchaidh]

What I am surprised that no one has picked up on is that Sainsbury's are claiming they will create up to 25 jobs. Whilst I know most of them will be part-time and none will be well paid, that is probably as many jobs as all the convenience stores put together. Look on the bright side folks, it's much needed jobs.

Jobs are rarely created. In this case the grocery market is saturated; the arrival of a new shop isn't not going to significantly increase (or decrease) our overall spend, only redistribute it, so the wages pot is pretty much fixed, so the number of jobs (in man-hours) is pretty much fixed.

[geofflynn]

I've compiled a quick survey to gather initial reaction to the news that Woodwares is closing and Sainsbury's Local to open on Porty High Street.

Just an initial toe in the water...

http://bit.ly/NJKAaX

What do you think?

[seanie]

Good god man! You can't just go around asking people what they think about something!!

Not without proper AUTHORITY!!

That way lies anarchy.

[urchaidh]

I will be gutted if this leads to the demise of Fine Wines though, I'm guessing they'll have an off licence.

[wangi]

I'm guessing they'll have an off licence.

I'm sure they will certainly apply.

[Epykat]

One good thing to come out of it though will be that if they open at 7am the Jakies can nip in for a ham roll before they stand outside the Central. Every cloud has a silver lining.

[Porty]

One good thing to come out of it though will be that if they open at 7am the Jakies can nip in for a ham roll before they stand outside the Central. Every cloud has a silver lining.

There could also be noise reduction benefits from having more plastic bags in circulation in Porty. It's not all bad.

[wangi]

Post from Alison Johnstone MSP:
http://alisonjohnstonemsp.com/?p=78

Porty Shops Will Be Squeezed As Sainsbury’s Moves In

After people in Portobello succeeded in fighting off an earlier supermarket development that would have ruined High Street trade this sneaky takeover is galling. I’m sure many people in the area will continue to support the superb range of local, independent retailers that directly benefit the area’s economy.

Sadly, across Edinburgh, we’ve seen the creeping presence of corporate interests that restrict choice by squeezing independent traders out of business. Are we not at saturation point?

Retail giants like Sainsbury’s have too much power, pushing small and medium sized retailers to the wall. Supermarkets are also in the dubious habit of donating large sums to the big political parties who conveniently do nothing to challenge their dominance.

As an Edinburgh councillor I successfully moved a motion to investigate whether we could ask for planning permission to be sought before this sort of sneaky takeover takes place. Last I heard the council had written to the Scottish Government and were waiting for a response.

[Puerto bella]

Lots of powerful language in there - shame is means not a lot.
So if some people dont like the idea of something then the developer should be asked to make a planning application even if no consent is required - presumably so it can be refused.......utterly crazy suggestion and makes a mockery of planning legislation.
Whats sneaky about it all?
Do you think she's serious or just ill advised?

[wangi]

Taken to the logical conclusion - equality to all applicants - it would probably mean than all changes of ownership would require reapplication for consent. So for example a Class 1 consent would not be associated with the property, but rather with both property and owner/lessee.

Personally I think that would mean all lot of extra red tape.

[thecrawfords]

Hi just joined site and wanted to add some other info
When the renovation was going on at Scotmid I mentioned to the manager that it was about time! stock outs were terrible etc and he mentioned that Scotmid was trying to improve because Marks and Spencer were apparently looking a the site of the old Land Rover garage (I presume across from Ramsey Tech unless there is another) (He never mentioned Sainsburys). I looked on the Edinburgh Council Portal Planning at the time but there was nothing listed and havent checked lately. Wonder if anyone else has heard of M & S moving in there?

[seanie]

The rumour was going around.

[Sceptic]

Here we go again, PAVED to the fore. The owner of Woodwares is retiring, one presumes the owner has tried to sell it as a going concern. Either there were no takers, or, equally possibly, anyone interested could not obtain the finance from the Banks. The owner could just close down the shop and leave it empty until there was a taker, or, in his /her own interests sell to Sainsburys. Given the size of the premises, it is not as if a Superstore was being parachuted in, we are talking of a local, small shop carrying only a part of Sainsburys' range. The first to fear is probably the Co-operative, but, it does have parking spaces which are not available on the High Street. It is the other small convenience stores who will have cause to worry, Kost Koncious, etc. If you remember, there were posts decying the type and range of shop available to Portobello Shoppers. What happens when a National Store wishes to open in Portobello? PAVED are in trying to stop it! When will some people start to realise that the 1950s will not return, that large grocery chains are what you get now. The rest of Portobello will have to specialise, Fine Wines will have to rely on their expertise and knowledge as their selling point, Finlays will have to rely on quality of product and Williamsons on freshness and, once again, specialist knowledge. So, to those who want to stop it, simply stop, think and ask, what do you really want? An empty shop? A small store selling a range of reasonable quality products at rasonable prices? There is also room now for a small hardware shop wher one can purchase six three inch black japanned screws. There is now the chance for someone to start.

admin: PAVED = Portobello Against Virtually Every Development

[Puerto bella]

Well said Sceptic.
M&S rumour is still live.

[gillian]

There is also room now for a small hardware shop wher one can purchase six three inch black japanned screws

A shop like Mr Thompson's, everything from nails, flasks, tools, camping gear, pac a macs, footwear, fridge magnets to Thomas tank engines bought as a treat for having a jag at the surgery across the road. How fantastic would that be?

[Franck]

" and the staff are a complete joke"

I must be going to a different shop, or have a different attitude, I think the staff, on the whole are helpful and friendly.

Me too.Shop might be crap ( has been since I work there over 20 years ago) but the staff are generally a decent lot.

[urchaidh]

Here we go again, PAVED to the fore.

You're right in that we shouldn't automatically assume that Sainburys' arrival is bad thing, but in a similar vein we shouldn't just assume that it's either a positive thing or indeed a fait accompli. I'm keen to hear the views of others, maybe see the issue from a different angle. Nothing is black and white.

Views will differ, from the undecided to those who have entrenched personal views; for example there may be those among us who have such an axe to grind with Scotmid that they'll welcome anyone onto the High Street with undisguised glee so long as it is to Scotmid's detriment.

[Porty]

I have no axe to grind with Scotmid but I do think they could do much better in Portobello. Take a look at their store near the corner of Pilrig Street or the one in Anstruther which I frequented on a recent holiday. In terms of shopfit and merchandising they are on a different planet from the investment made in Porty. If the recent "refurb" was designed to combat a threat from M &S it is a joke, like rearranging a pile of dirty dishes to make it seem a bit better.

Scotmid, as part of the C0-OP, have 7% market share of the UK Food market versus 16% for Sainsbury's. We are not talking David and Goliath. The pricing in Scotmid porty is pitched at the "Metro" or "Express" point, it is expensive. Better value and choice could be on the way for the people of Porty.

Goodness knows how the minnows will fair?

[urchaidh]

Scotmid, as part of the C0-OP, have 7% market share of the UK Food market versus 16% for Sainsbury's.

As I understand it Scotmid are not part of 'The Cooperative', but a wholly separate entity. They buy from the wholesale arm of the Cooperative group, so may gain them some advantages in terms of having the buying power of a bigger player - depends on the deal the CoOp cut them.

Their revenue in 2011 was £430 million compared with around £21 billion for Sainsburys. This includes all sorts of other things other than groceries, but it gives you a better idea of the differences in scale.

[Porty]

Various brands are listed under the Co-Op umbrella and Scotmid are one of them. My source was Wiki and it can be flawed!!

The main point i was making is that Scotmid have not invested in Porty to the extent they have elsewhere. And they are priced like a "metro" type city centre store.

[Chas]

Various brands are listed under the Co-Op umbrella and Scotmid are one of them.

As I understand it, Scotmid are one of the few Co-ops which are still independent of the Manchester based Co-op which both runs the wholesale division and has bought up all the small, regional groups over the years. Whilst the Pilrig branch is Scotmid (I think?) my experience is that the non-Scotmid Co-ops are much better and are mounting a serious challenge to the big 4 supermarket chains. So what we need now is for Scotmid to be swallowed up by the big Co-op and then we might see improvements. But then again, someone would mount a 'Save Our Co-op' campaign…

[Sceptic]

Rosa, my point exactly, there is room for specialised shops in Portobello. You have to have a selling point whether it is because you have specialised knowledge or expertise for your customers, Mike Heath( Mike's Tackle Shop) as an example. Small shops cannot compete with the big guys on price, it has to be a unique selling angle. It's the difference between a bottle of Sainsburys' Plonk or a bottle of Mas de Daumas Gassac from Fine Wine, not interchangable but both filling a certain need! In addition, competition is healthy, it does keep everyone on their toes. I doubt that Sainsburys will try to kill off everyone.

[geofflynn]

Sainsbury's Local Survey Results after 24 hours: Majority who responded unhappy to see Woodwares close, but slightly more saying they're pleased to see Sainsbury's Local than saying they're unhappy.

See full survey results here --> http://bit.ly/S2dQhi




If you want to complete the survey, go here --> http://bit.ly/NJKAaX

[Porty]

Be interestingly to see how Pcc play this one. You will recall that 95% support for ppag to abandons the court action.Was barely enough to secure a neutral position from them! Lol Not !

[wangi]

Sainsbury's Local Survey Results after 24 hours: Majority who responded unhappy to see Woodwares close, but slightly more saying they're pleased to see Sainsbury's Local than saying they're unhappy.

See full survey results here --> http://bit.ly/S2dQhi

If you want to complete the survey, go here --> http://bit.ly/NJKAaX

Thanks for the work Geoff, lets put if visually with some numbers:

Woodwares closing: 84.1% unhappy; 15.9% neutral; 00.0% pleased



Sainsbury's opening: 33.6 unhappy; 27.6 neutral; 38.7 pleased



Extended opening hours: 19.6 unhappy; 31.7 neutral; 46.8 pleased



Groceries competition: 36.7 unhappy; 27.1 neutral; 36.1 pleased



Create 20-25 jobs: 07.5 unhappy; 32.2 neutral; 60.3 pleased



Support local charities: 07.0 unhappy; 39.7 neutral; 53.3 pleased

[magbagpuss]

I have sat on the side lines so far and listened with interest. Firstly , yes it will be devastating to loose Woodies , as non-drivers it is vital to us .We have shopped there over 23 years so it will be the end of and era.You always got helpful advice and they would happily order what you needed. What has not always been remembered is that it is their business and if they choose to retire good on them .Retail is hard demanding work .

Secondly Sainsburys is a very responsible retailer. They constantly pay market rate and above . Retail has never been well paid . I work with a large number of graduates who after graduating find themselves working in retail so it is not a case we are thick. I love my job helping people get what they need . I get huge job satisfaction.

Finally surely any jobs coming into Porty can only be a good thing . Given the proposed opening hours they will need substancially more staff than are employed in the store at the moment . Also it will be more labour intensive with re-stocking and till bashing. Wonder if Sainsburys plan to offer the non-family members of staff a job ? They have not been considered here at all and it is them that are most affected .

Yes We will be welcoming Sainsburys , competition is good and may buck the "Store " up though I love the store staff , great people and you are always sure of a laugh !

[gillian]

Yes We will be welcoming Sainsburys , competition is good and may buck the "Store " up though I love the store staff , great people and you are always sure of a laugh !


Hear! Hear! or is it Here Here !! never been sure.

[Porty]

Well said mabagpuss.

This is an interesting issue. i find myself agreeing with points from all sides of the debate. Woodwares is and was a brilliant contributor to PHS and a main player in the campaign to prevent the supermarket crawl throttling Portobello.

Woodwares legacy to the High Street is Sainsbury's, which will not tarnish their fond rememberance.

BTW; there's not going to be any "battle"- Sainsbury's will be open about a month after they get the keys.

[magbagpuss]

Do you know when that will be ?

Can and will we do something for the Woodies team ? Do you all think they would like that ?
We could all contribute a wee line or story of what Woodies meant to us ? Make a book ?

[Bob Jefferson]

Lovely idea magbagpuss. Not sure about a book but a tribute thread is certainly in order. I'm amused that PCATS are suggesting that Woodwares gave up because of trading conditions. They obviously don't want to have to admit that a local business strongly associated with their campaign have sold out to the dark forces. Clearly, they were made an offer they couldn't refuse and retirement suddenly became an attractive option. Who can blame them? I think we can live with Sainsbury's and it may well turn out to be an asset. We have a great selection of independent businesses right now and this may be an anchor that helps to hold it together. And it's not Tesco.

[minnie1957]

Unfortunately, in this economic climate, more and more small independant shops will have to close. I speak from personal experience when I say that no matter how much expertise you have,no matter how much customer satisfaction you give,no matter how well stocked you are, if the money isnt coming in you cannot survive. Many customers will come in and say what a lovely shop you have, how nice it is to have personal attention and will then go visit a large store where the price is better. The price elsewhere is better, because to survive in an independant shop you cannot afford to compete with thier prices. I feel that all action groups trying to stop this are hitting thier heads off a brick wall, it cannot be stopped. You can all try but the best you will acheive is empty shops or charity shops and we are half way there already.

[Bob Jefferson]

That's a rather gloomy view of the situation. I would say that we currently have the best selection of shops, bars and restaurants that Portobello has seen in a long time and a huge improvement on what it looked like 20 years ago when I first moved here.

[minnie1957]

In the past 24 months Portobello High Street has lost; Pet Shop, Stationers, Dolls House Shop, Craft Shop, Wine Bar, Pub, Ink Cartridge Shop, Charity Shops, and 2 Clothing Shops. Two shops which were empty 6 years ago are still empty. Now we have lost Woodwares, one of the best independant retailers on the High Street. They cannot compete with B & Q, no independant shop can, and no matter how many customers say its a shame they are gone you can bet the same people will jump in thier car this Sunday and go to B & Q for something, because they can park the car and be in and out in 5 minutes and pay less for the item. Sadly, if we do not let the big boys like Sainsburys into the High Street then the shopping experience in Portobello really will be finished.

[Bob Jefferson]

It's true that we have lost a number of shops but in most cases others have replaced them. That's part of the natural evolution of the High Street. We now have a new pet shop, the Craft Shop has been replaced by a great new cafe and the Wine Bar is now a popular bistro. And why did the owners at Woodware's retire? Because they couldn't compete with B&Q? Didn't they compete very successfully with B&Q for a very long time? Or because Sainsbury's made them an offer they couldn't refuse?