Annie and Belle Cafe (was: The shops thread)

[Porty]

The confusion may have occured once the officers read beyond the first sentence. Perhaps they stopped before they got to the sentence where it said: there was a strong consensus amongst community councillors (11-2) not to object to either application . That was in the letter, right Marya?

The opening line is classic John Stewart "whilst I have no objection in principle ........"

He then follows up with as many potential objections as he can muster.. Believe me; our planning officers are used to the format . A seemingly objective start followed by a truckload of mostly irrelevant tosh.

[seanie]

Extra tables at cafe should have been a piece of cake

Your article “Ruling puts lid on cafe’s bid to create more space” (News, March 12) highlights to me the assumption that community councillors and other self-important officials know what’s best.

For Diana Cairns to object the application at Belle cafe was a mistake and a backward step for Portobello. Would she rather see our High Street shops closed and boarded up?

I know Ms Cairns has in the past campaigned against large superstores moving in to Portobello, but Belle Cafe is hardly your giant retailer.

This decision will only hit the people that would have benefited most from a cake and tea house and that is the older community and mothers with toddlers.

What more could you ask for on a cold winter day in Porty, than some old fashioned chit-chat, a good brew and a nice piece of cake?

C Ross, Prestonfield

[Mark Cameron]

Had a quick look over at the petition and there are now 170 signatures on it. Wonder how many people the community council canvassed to see if the community feeling is to stifle new business?

[Porty]

Hopefully someone brings this issue up at PCC on Monday.

[rmolehusband]

Hopefully someone brings this issue up at PCC on Monday.

Couldn't someone propose a motion to the effect that, given the obvious level of support within the community for this business, the community council should write to the council in support of granting a change of use.

[seanie]

It's been requested as an item for Monday and it'll probably be discussed under Planning.

[Porty]

Yeah thats what I hope would happen. In reality it will be difficult to get the issue on the agenda. A letter of support would mean a reversal of the previous PCC letter.

[Puerto bella]

Hopefully someone brings this issue up at PCC on Monday.

Couldn't someone propose a motion to the effect that, given the obvious level of support within the community for this business, the community council should write to the council in support of granting a change of use.

Would be good to hear how this plays out at the CC and how they are going to help Annie and Belle overcome the Local Review Body decision on their appeal - given that there is a significant body of support for this business in our community?

[Porty]

will be good to learn how it goes at CC. To be fair there was a significant body of support amongst the CC NOT to object first time around. Didn't appear to count for much, did it? Can the LRB decision be overturned ?

[seanie]

Well the discussion lasted over an hour but didn't reach a firm conclusion. It will be brought back to a later meeting after some further fact finding.

[Puerto bella]

The appeal route after Local Review Body would have been to the court of session for A&B but I think they're out of time for that now so that decision cant be quashed.

A new application would effectively have to overcome the LRB decision - an uphill climb whatever way you look at it and if its an exact repeat then the council could consider not to register it ......

I am keen to learn if the CC rather than cutting and pasting pre-recession planning policies would consider thinking about what it actually takes in the current economic climate for a business to get funding to get off the ground, never mind make it a success as these ladies are doing, that is hugely significant to Portobello as a place and no-one on the CC seems to get that. People like A&B - they like the design, atmosphere, service and general ambience that it has - we should not be stifling it.

[seanie]

There were divergent views amongst PCC members.

Points raised in favour were that this was a high quality business, providing local employment, adding to the High Street, with significant support within the community that the PCC should reflect.

Points against were that a change of use would breach the current planning policy, that supporting an application against policy would weaken arguments against other applications based on policy, that even though this particular cafe was an attractive business the change of use could allow a less desirable operator to occupy the premises in the future, and that by supporting this particular application we would be supporting an individual business in a way that might appear inconsistent and unfair.

There were other points but those are the main ones I recall.

[Porty]

I know the issue was initially change of use. I thought the latest application was for two extra tables not a full change of use, am i mistaken?

[seanie]

I think the Planners were initially relaxed about the use, but as you'll be aware there has been a bit of fuss recently about such things including enforcement and retrospective applications. When it came to it the Planners took the view that the additional tables tipped the balance from retail to food. I suppose there's an element of judgement I'n that, but that was the reason for the application.

[seanie]

On a minor point, if anyone was in attendance and got a copy of the 'Annie and Bell's Relevant Timeline' a correction is required.

It suggests the cafe was opened and operating prior to the original planning application being determined, in October 2011, when in truth the lease on the property wasn't taken until mid-November and the cafe opened on 7th December.

I don't know who authored the document, but the PCC Chair has been asked if an accurate timeline could be circulated.

[Lou]

Why don't they just move over the road to Kitcheners old shop and save themselves all the hassle !?

admin: replies re Victor Hugo in old Kitchener's location moved to the shops thread.

[Porty]

On a minor point, if anyone was in attendance and got a copy of the 'Annie and Bell's Relevant Timeline' a correction is required.

It suggests the cafe was opened and operating prior to the original planning application being determined, in October 2011, when in truth the lease on the property wasn't taken until mid-November and the cafe opened on 7th December.

I don't know who authored the document, but the PCC Chair has been asked if an accurate timeline could be circulated.

Its a fairly significant correction particularly in a document that formed the basis of discussion. You say you don't know who authored the piece? Surely the responsibility lies fairly a d squarely with the Chair himself ?