New Portobello High School - PPAG/"Save Porty Park"

[Pal of Porty]

What PPAG actually first suggested was this;

The Figgate Park is dismissed as an option for a rebuild of St John's because of risk of flooding. This site is only one metre below the level of the current St John's and a good ten metres above the level of the burn; the risk of flooding is negligible and could be totally eliminated. This site should be consulted upon for St John's.

No mention of playing fields on the existing site, just an insistence that Figgate Park be considered for St John's.

There is no doubt about it seanie. I still have a copy of the EEN with the famous Ros Sutherland letter in it and I even have a screen shot of Alison Connelly stating on POL that Portobello PArk would be a suitable site for St. John's!!!!!

[seanie]

Happy to deny(again) that the suggestion to build on Figgate Park was made.

What we have suggested is that a flat, featureless area of Figgate Park at the end of Hamilton Terrace could be considered for the rebuild St John's.

The Figgate Park is dismissed as an option for a rebuild of St John's because of risk of flooding. This site is only one metre below the level of the current St John's and a good ten metres above the level of the burn; the risk of flooding is negligible and could be totally eliminated. This site should be consulted upon for St John's.

To be fair to Save Porty Park, it can't be easy keeping track of all the contradictory statements, untruths and misrepresentations that PPAG have come out with over the years.

[Mark Cameron]

Does anyone have any idea how their fund raising efforts are going? If they get anywhere near the amount they need to put in a serious challenge is there likely to be the need for a pro-school group to raise funds to attempt to block this?

[seanie]

Not really. It's between them, the Council and the Court of Session. I'd imagine the Council will defend their position vigourously and will be seeking to have the petition dismissed at the earliest opportunity.

[Porty]

Is there evidence that a petition or any other legal process has begun? (PPAG website doesn't count as evidence)

[seanie]

The bulldozers have been at the park. It looks like speed archaeology.

[Porty]

Any pics?

[Makaveli]

There is one on here:-

http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set= ... 3087147188

[Porty]

Thanks!!

Peachy.

[saveportypark]

Nice to see the council have dug up the park but can't be bothered to even make it look half decent in the meantime.
Wonder if we will end up with a half built school and a trashed park, right now the council's ability to make anything happen is seriously in question. If you are arranging a party in a beer manufacturing facility, I wouldn't ask Edinburgh Council to help.

coming soon to a park near you

[seanie]

You've come back. Excellent.

So why, in defence of their claim that the Council's 'traffic survey described the A1 as a minor road’, have the Portobello Park Action Group cited a document that a) isn't a traffic survey and b) doesn't describe the A1 as a minor road?

Why have the Portobello Park Action Group provided three incompatible claims regarding the document containing this claim?

a)“What Sean has in his hands has NEVER been printed by PPAG. It was on our facebook page for a very short time (as confirmed by Sean Watters and others), its' purpose was to get feedback from supporters”

b)“Sean is holding a poster put up around the park, it was not handed round schools “

c)“we used the image on a poster but the text was different - that is why I know the version Sean has did not come from us”?

What are the developments that the Portobello Park Action Group claim have been planned for Figgate & Quarry Parks in recent months?

Why have the Portobello Park Action Group said that “the council stand to make a significant profit from the sale of the existing school site to property developers but have not said how this will be spent” when the council has indeed said how any capital receipt will be spent; for capital investment in the school estate, specifically the remaining Wave 3 schools?

Why do the Portobello Park Action Group say they oppose development on any green space, when the Portobello Park Action Group have suggested Bingham Park, Jewel Park and Greenbelt land as suitable alternatives for the high school?

Why do the Portobello Park Action Group say it would be possible to build on the former Lismore School site without the loss of any green space, when that would mean moving the school from a site that's only 40% of the recommended minimum, to one that's only 20% of the recommended minimum?

How do the Portobello Park Action Group propose to fit a secondary school of 1400 pupils onto the site of a primary school built for 270 without losing any green space on Bingham Park?

When asking for donations for the Portobello Park Action Group legal case, why do they never mention to people that the established legal precedent is that permission from the courts is not required to develop schools on Common Good land?

Why do the Portobello Park Action Group never explain to people that rulings from the Courts of Session have established that, since the land remains in council ownership and is used to the continuing benefit of the community, schools are compatible with the Common Good status and no permission from the Courts is required to proceed?

Why do the Portobello Park Action Group state that “the Golf Course will be lost if the school is built on the Park” when the original high school sat close to the park quite happily for several decades?

Why do the Portobello Park Action Group state that “housing will be built on the course” when there are no such proposals and such a development would be incompatible with the Common Good status of the land?

Since the Portobello Park Action Group profess concern about “the possibility of children being knocked down by speeding vehicles on Milton Road”, why have the Portobello Park Action Group spent the last three years promoting Lismore as a better site, when that would result in a fourfold increase in the number of children having to cross it?

Why do the Portobello Park Action Group say that the school will result in the "loss of 25% of our precious parkland" when there are over 52Ha of parks in the local area, and the school and playing fields won't even take up 5Ha?

And have the Portobello Park Action Group found the Council’s traffic survey yet?

[Porty]

If you are arranging a party in a beer manufacturing facility, I wouldn't ask PPAG to help.

[seanie]

Was today not the day of the great park run?

[Bob Jefferson]

Was it? They kept it pretty quiet then.

[Bob Jefferson]

Hang on, just found this on scottishathletics.org.uk

DETAILS

Name:
Save the Park 5K Running Race * POSTPONED *

Venue:
Portobello Golf Course

Type:
RR

Fixture Date:
Thursday 01 September, 2011
Events:

Contact Phone:
07776 194169

Email:
s.coventry@nhs.net
Details:
Start Time 7.30pm

I wonder if S. Coventry knows the facts relating to the park?

[Porty]

I wonder if S. Coventry knows the facts relating to the park?

There's an S Coventry on the PPAG fundraising committee.
http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?q=mole& ... 3&bih=725

They must be gutted at having to postpone their only public fundraising event in the last 3 years or so.

[portygeoff]

Just been looking at the PPAG site. It starts of with a lie about representing the 'significant majority' and the proceeds to list further lies as highlighted above. No wonder their support is dwindling. Lost the arguments but cannot accept it so resort to further untruths. Shame.

[Bob Jefferson]

From the Planning Department Portal:

From: Coventry, Sheila
Sent: 05 November 2010 18:36
To: Lesley Carus
Subject: portobello high school planning application

To whom it may concern,

As a mother of a child in primary 3 at Towerbank, I am very keen to have a new and modern Portobello High school built. I do, however, have grave concern with the planning application proposal for the new high school. First of all, the location of the proposed new school is very dangerous with the A1 road on one side of the school and a golf course on the other. I often pass the current Portobello high school just as it is closing at lunch time or at the end of the day. The pupils pour out of the school, chatting and larking around with other pupils, walking, running etc on the road. They are more preoccupied with other pupils than the traffic around them. This behaviour is guaranteed to continue. The school should not be built next to a road as busy and dangerous as the A1(milton road) where the chances of a pupil being hit by a vehicle will be dramatically increased. Secondly, no matter what is done to try and prevent the pupils walking on the golf course, it will happen. The golf course is another dangerous place. Will the planners be held accountable when the first child (pupil) is hit by a golf ball and is seriously injured in some way, or worst of all killed? My mother was hit by a golf ball on Portobello golf course. She is lucky to be alive.

Regards

Sheila Coventry

[Lima]

Yes she is very lucky to be alive. Phew

If anyone was to be hit by a golf ball it would be from a distance so unlikely to cause any harm, never mind killed. If they were to be hit by a golf ball traveling at speed they would have to be close to the person swinging the club which would not be the case as the golfer would not take a swing if there was someone that close so is an invalid argument

[Lima]

[Franck]

I've been hit by golf balls a few times, sometimes a deliberate act of tom-foolery when I was younger with pals ( always at pgc) sometimes accidentally when playing golf.I can confirm it hurts like buggery, but I can also confirm I'm still alive.

I'd take a punt and say more people are killed playing football over golf so in effect, building the new school on football pitches beside a golf course is a sure fire way of reducing sport related deaths in the Portobello area.A new school on the park-a gift that keeps on giving.

[Porty]

Sheila may have a point. In decades of life threatening stunts, mutiple fractures, many operations, all wrapped up in a devil may care attitude. Never, and I do mean never, did Evil Kneivel choose to risk traversing a Golf course in his stunt bike.

[Makaveli]

I played golf the other day and looking back can't believe the unnecessary risk I took by going on the course without full body armour.

Dodged a bullet there!!!

[Porty]

-

[Bob Jefferson]

Come again?

[Mark Cameron]

Just noticed a link from the PPAG website to an epetition with a whopping great 800ish signatories - now is that what they're basing their claims of 'majority support fromthe community' on?

[seanie]

That's the petition from 2006, referring to schools and housing on the park. It's no longer relevant.

[Pal of Porty]

The argument of PPAG that they represent 'the majority' was blown out the water when more people wrote in support of the planning application than against it. Almost unprecedented in planning terms.

[Pal of Porty]

I note from Ms Coventry in her letter above she emphasises that despite being a Towerbank parent she is still opposed to building a new High School in the Park. The use of a PHS Feeder School in the statement could lead one to assume that Ms Coventy herself will be becoming a 'PHS parent', which somewhat contradicts previous statements from her, where she claims to be finding it difficult to support school fees.

[Porty]

Seems quite a few public school bods are deeply concerned about the safety of PHS pupils. We have recently had representations from FP's of George Watson's and Stewarts Melville. And the planning portal has an essay from a former Herioter, now PE teacher, who appears heartbroken by the loss of the park where his lifelong friendships were formed. Seems all his mates survived playing on a park adjacent to the Golf Course.
Amazing, isn't it?

Some parents of Holyrood kids are also amongst the most vociferous about the threat of the Milton Road to our pupils. Which is touching, considering their own kids have to negotiate the very same road on an almost daily basis to get to school. Do they care for the safety of our kids more than they do their own, I'm welling up here.

[wangi]

Forth One were running with PPAG's legal bid as their lead story this morning... Interview with Cllr Marilyne Maclaren... Suggestion this would result in 6 month delay to opening date. Article now at http://www.forthone.com/news/local/coun ... bello-high

And in the EN: http://news.scotsman.com/edinburgh/MacL ... 6835525.jp

MacLaren to fight last-ditch legal bid to block new school

CITY education leader Marilyne MacLaren has vowed to fight a legal bid to stop a new high school being built on Portobello Park as she hit out at protesters for delaying the project and potentially costing the council more money.

Councillor MacLaren today said she was "hugely disappointed" in Portobello Park Action Group (PPAG) for raising the petition in the Court of Session.

...

[wangi]

Cllr MacLaren's press release:

COUNCIL WILL DEFEND PLANS FOR NEW HIGH SCHOOL IN COURT

Edinburgh Council has confirmed that that it will vigorously defend its plans to build the new Portobello High School on Portobello Park. A local action group (Portobello Park Action Group) has raised a petition in the Court of Session in an attempt to prevent the plans going ahead but the Council is confident there are no legal impediments to prevent the school being built on the park.

Councillor Marilyne MacLaren, Convener of Education, Children and Families, said: “Portobello High School is the school most in need of replacement in the city and I’m hugely disappointed that a small group of local residents are trying to stop it. This group has known about our plans for many years, have actively participated in the consultation and planning process and yet have waited until we’re just about to appoint a contractor before taking this action,

“I was really pleased when the project team managed to find a way to pull forward the school opening date to August 2013 and I’m now bitterly disappointed that we will now have to go back to the original date of January 2014 due to the court action. I know the school community will share my disappointment as they were keen to move at the start of a new school year rather than mid-way through”.

“The council is determined not only to defend the plans but also to take every step possible to avoid any delays to the opening of the new school and, at a time of severe budget pressures, to limit any additional costs to the Council. From the start it was agreed that any budget savings made in the Portobello project would be used to support other new school projects so this action could also impact on other schools.”

The Council has obtained legal advice from senior counsel that says that it is possible to build this much-needed replacement school in Portobello Park. The proposals have the support of the vast majority of the local community. Indeed, during the planning process, planners received more comments in support of the proposals than against, something that doesn’t normally happen as experience shows those in favour don’t normally make their views heard. The Council believes this demonstrates the support for our new school. During the consultation process, many local residents also recognised that the new school could become a great community asset with its new facilities available for public use outside school hours.

The Council intends to move forward with the tendering process and a report will go to the September Council Meeting on the next steps for the project and how the risk of delay to the opening of the school will be mitigated.

Note to Editors
A report will go to the Council on 22 September outlining the next steps in the Portobello Project
Initial consultation on the site of the new school took place in 2006 with funding agreed in February 2009. Since that period, consultation has taken place with the local community on the designs for the new school and planning permission has been granted

[Porty]

It is bitterly disappointing that the School will likely be delayed for a few months but it is not the end of the world. Just two or three years ago it looked very much like PHS would be further down the pecking order than Gillespies etc. It looked like there would be no money available in the forseeable future, we have come a long way. There is no reasonable grounds for believing that the School won't be built.

A "small group of local residents are trying to stop it" - is correct.

[Pal of Porty]

"Residents" is not the first word that sprung up in my mind to describe this group.

[Mark Cameron]

As you say Porty, a delay isn't the end of the world but it is frustrating as hell that a minority of residents can have this effect on the project.