Tommy Sheridan

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 12 Oct 2006, 12:38

Dadaist wrote:
Porty wrote:
Dadaist wrote:
No matter how wildly ridiculous the claim, I think that if the person who makes it believes it to be true, they're not a liar in that instance.

So if Tommy believed that Scotland beat the Ukraine 4-5 last night and told everyone, he wouldn't be lying?
Exactly right. He would be laughed at, but you'd need to prove he intended deception or was being malicious in order for it to be a lie.
.

What about if people believed in Tommy's football result integrity and he had promised that he would be honest about football results? Would the same still apply?

Dadaist · Post by **Dadaist** » 12 Oct 2006, 12:42

Porty wrote:Didn't Ming also say that they won a by election that they didn't?

Yeah - I was thinking of that one too.

I think the point that the media were trying to make during all that was that he is unfit to govern because of those mistakes - and they wanted to show Charlie K coming back from rehab to wild applause.

But I take your point - if, when Ming said that to his assembled conference and the world, he actually knew in his mind that they had lost that seat and was deliberately trying to get more Lib Dem votes or something then he was lying through his teeth.

The definition of "lie" that I understand is a malicious falsehood.

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 12 Oct 2006, 13:11

Dadaist wrote:
The definition of "lie" that I understand is a malicious falsehood.

In relation to lie is that the only definition that you understand?

gilo · Post by **gilo** » 12 Oct 2006, 13:14

I must say this does remind me of when the govt. lied about Iraq and WMD and hid behind it not being intentional.

Dadaist · Post by **Dadaist** » 12 Oct 2006, 13:43

Porty wrote:
Dadaist wrote:
The definition of "lie" that I understand is a malicious falsehood.
In relation to lie is that the only definition that you understand?

I don't know - I hadn't really thought about any other definitions. I guess I must see the things you see as "lies" as falsehoods, and the people who tell them as mistaken, until such time as you can prove malicious intent or intent to deceive.

ali · Post by **ali** » 12 Oct 2006, 13:49

Porty wrote:Didn't Ming also say that they won a by election that they didn't?

That's ridiculous!!! The Arctic Monkeys have never even stood for election, (as far as I know

) never mind won a bye-election

Dadaist · Post by **Dadaist** » 12 Oct 2006, 13:52

Gilo wrote:I must say this does remind me of when the govt. lied about Iraq and WMD and hid behind it not being intentional.

I think that you have to be quite strict, and prove intent to mislead. Rather than saying that because no WMDs were found the initial statements were deliberate lies to get us to go to war, it's much better to be able to really stick the knife into Blair by proving that him and his master knew it was rubbish and set out to deceive their publics into war.

That's probably why all the Hutton business was so controversial.

I you should save the word "lie" for those occasions where you can clearly show the malicious nature and intent to deceive - it does much greater damage to your enemies than cheapening the word by attributing it to error and falsehood.

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 12 Oct 2006, 14:46

Is a dream a lie that don't come true or is it something worse?

Dadaist · Post by **Dadaist** » 12 Oct 2006, 15:27

Is that a quote?

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 12 Oct 2006, 15:28

It is. From "The River" by Bruce Springsteen

Novastar · Post by **Novastar** » 12 Oct 2006, 23:34

I didn't realise the BBC 2 Thursday comedy block continued onto BBC1. Did anyone checkout Clive Anderson's glare when Tommy was ranting about North Korea - a strange combination of 'you are so wrong' and 'I want to punch him'.

Very funny

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 13 Oct 2006, 11:56

You have got to admire TS cohones, its like butter wouldn't melt. He does spraff some nonsense but he is super quick at spotting a sound-bite opportunity. I felt the glaswegian audience were a bit less supportive than normal but he is still popular. They liked Clive Anderson more.

Did anyone see the Mcneilage interview the other night? Apparently he comes across as totally believable and as far as I know he doesn't work for Murdoch.

Maria · Post by **Maria** » 05 Nov 2006, 11:44

As Tommy addresses conference here's a wee musical tribute to The King of the Swingers

Izzie · Post by **Izzie** » 05 Nov 2006, 12:47

Very good.Who sings it?

Maria · Post by **Maria** » 05 Nov 2006, 13:58

It's a guy called Tommy MacKay.

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 24 Apr 2007, 18:57

From Todays' Evening News:

SSP vital as an alternative choice

WHILST I very much regret that L Williams from Straiton will not be voting SSP (Your Views, 19 April), I am nonetheless proud of my record in representing working people throughout the Lothians these last four years.

As far as Tommy Sheridan's ill judged court action is concerned I stand by every word I said and every action I took. I have no doubt whatsoever that the Scottish Socialist Party will be completely vindicated in due course. In the meantime, I am confident of success again on May 3 as the SSP MSP for the Lothians. As an alternative to the four parties of the right, is more important than ever.

Colin Fox, Scottish Socialist Party National Convener, Clerk Street

Dadaist · Post by **Dadaist** » 04 May 2007, 07:52

Lost his seat.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/gla ... 622865.stm

Pal of Porty · Post by **Pal of Porty** » 04 May 2007, 10:04

He'll be back! Hasta la vista baby.

Dadaist · Post by **Dadaist** » 04 May 2007, 11:37

Tomminator 2!

Maria · Post by **Maria** » 19 Feb 2008, 21:39

It's not been a good day for those on the left. Fidel Castro resigns and Tommy's nearest and dearest are charged with perjury. Ah well, at least Northern Rock is set to be nationalised

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 25 Feb 2008, 13:22

From the Evening News:

Lothian police spend £1m in Sheridan perjury inquiry

POLICE have spent more than £1 million on the investigation into allegations of perjury stemming from former MSP Tommy Sheridan's defamation case.
Mr Sheridan's Solidarity party said figures obtained from Lothian and Borders Police under the Freedom of Information Act also revealed that 40,000 hours of police officers' time had been taken up by the inquiry.

The party said this was money and manpower which "could have been better placed elsewhere".

Mr Sheridan, 43, was charged with perjury in December – around 16 months after he won his £200,000 action against the News of the World at the Court of Session in Edinburgh. Six others who appeared as witnesses in the case have also been charged with perjury, including Mr Sheridan's wife Gail, 44, his father-in-law Gus Healy, 71, and former Solidarity MSP Rosemary Byrne.

Mrs Sheridan has also been suspended from her job as a British Airways air hostess amid theft allegations, which she denies. They are understood to involve the discovery by police of miniature drink bottles found at the Sheridans' home in Glasgow.

At the weekend, Mr Sheridan claimed police were carrying out a "vendetta" against him and his wife.

On his regular Saturday morning radio show, he accused Lothian and Borders Police of doing "everything in their power to undermine me".

He claimed the force wasting public money and police time in carrying out the perjury inquiry.

He said: "They have taken a 44-year-old mother of one and grilled her for six, yes six, hours before charging her. Lothian and Borders Police, I ask you: 'Are you pleased with yourselves?'

"The police have, in my opinion, been conducting a vendetta, as far as I am concerned. It seems to be the most one-sided inquiry in history.

"I have got to say that I have changed my view of Lothian and Borders Police. The investigation was not into the trial, but into me. They have tried to do everything in their power to undermine me."

The information supplied by the force under Freedom of Information legislation said the investigation had taken roughly 40,000 hours of police time costed at around £25 an hour. There was also a specific budget for the investigation which had run to £153,746, including overtime and expenses

An average of 14 police officers have been committed to the inquiry for more than a year.

The information was obtained by Hugh Kerr, a close aide of Mr Sheridan's. He said: "As a Lothians council tax payer I am appalled at the huge waste of taxpayers' money on this police vendetta."

Activists from Solidarity were on the streets of Edinburgh and Glasgow at the weekend, collecting signatures for a petition supporting the Sheridans.

A spokesman said: "We call on the Crown Office to instruct Lothian and Borders Police to end this vendetta against Tommy Sheridan, his family and his political allies."

Lothian and Borders Police declined to comment.

The full article contains 500 words and appears in Edinburgh Evening News newspaper.Last Updated: 25 February 2008 10:13 AM

£25 per hour for 40000- 14 full time policeman = £1million. So that means our bobbies earn about £70k each for working an average of 54 hours a week. Don't think that would stand up in court.

Even if it did cost £1,000.000 it is worth it to protect the integrity of outr court system. The claims of a vendetta are a similar tactic to the cries of bullying we used to hear on POL. Similar in so much as there is no evidence to support either claim.

Maria · Post by **Maria** » 25 Feb 2008, 16:29

Porty wrote:From the Evening News:

He [Tommy Sheridan] said: "They have taken a 44-year-old mother of one and grilled her for six, yes six, hours before charging her. Lothian and Borders Police, I ask you: 'Are you pleased with yourselves?'

What has being "a 44-year-old mother of one" got to do with it?

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 25 Feb 2008, 17:41

Good point Marya; Peter Sutcliffe's wife; Sonia, had several miscarriages. Had she been succesful would it have been outrageously unreasonable to interview a father of one or more, about the 13 murders he perpetrated?

Whats a 71 Years old grandfather got to with it either?

I believe that Gail " a woman who has never been in trouble" Sheridan has been suspended from work over suspected theft of drinks minatures. I think it is terrible that the police are in the frame for bringing this family's name into ill repute.

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 26 Jan 2011, 12:16

http://news.stv.tv/scotland/223474-liv ... entencing/

You can't fault TS for putting up a fight, he's throwing everything at it.

Talk Porty ~ Portobello

Tommy Sheridan

Question Time

a wee musical interlude

Re: Tommy Sheridan