British Summer Time

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 19 Mar 2007, 14:31

Personally I can't wait, it always cheers me up as the end of March approaches and the oppositye applies at the end of October.

Many of you probably know that in the US this year they are trying an experiment. Their clocks moved forward two weekends ago, they are adding three weeks on a the beginning of summer time amd one week at the end. It is thought that this adjustment will save energy, road accidents and fatalities.

Even if it doesn't I would be more than happy to back such a move here.

Epykat · Post by **Epykat** » 19 Mar 2007, 15:56

Did they not try something different when we were at Primary? Remember us all going about in the pitch dark til about 10am with fluorescent armbands on

arachnid · Post by **arachnid** » 19 Mar 2007, 18:23

Epykat wrote:Did they not try something different when we were at Primary? Remember us all going about in the pitch dark til about 10am with fluorescent armbands on

They did! One year they decided not to change the clocks, but it didn't work well, so it was back to changing them the next year.
Can't remember exactly what year it was though!

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 19 Mar 2007, 18:30

The form of governmental tampering has generally been the institution of Summer Time, advancing the legal time by one hour during the summer months in order to promote greater efficiency in the use of the daylight hours and of artificial lighting; originally introduced as a wartime measure in 1916, this has been continued through peacetime as well, with occasional variations such as double summer time (advancing the clocks by a second hour for part of the summer) in World War 2—the government files on which in the Public Record Office (now National Archives) having, when the closure period was first set (probably late 1960s), been deemed so sensitive as to merit a closure period of 100 years—and the experiment with British Standard Time from 1968 to 1972, by which the time was advanced by one hour from GMT throughout the year. In addition, the precise start and end dates and times for Summer Time have been the subject of a great many individual orders detailed below. Adjusting the clocks has been an extremely effective way of really changing the times at which most people work (as measured on a uniform time scale), while giving the misleading impression that they are not changing the times at which they work, but rather an act of government has changed the times at which the sun rises and sets. (In February 2000 I requested a review of the extended closure period of the World War 2 summer time records, and in May the Home Office concluded that they could now be opened to the public.)

Every so often, someone tries again to institute the keeping in the UK of a time one hour ahead of GMT in winter, and two hours ahead in summer. Apart from arguments concerning notional convenience in dealing with Europe, the arguments for this seek lighter evenings (say, after work), the arguments against lighter mornings (say, for children going to school); and either side may quote statistics on accident rates that suit its cause. My personal view is that we should do away with the twice annual changing of clocks and maintain UTC as legal time for the whole year. Those people wishing for lighter evenings could arrange with their employers to start and finish work earlier—with changes in working practices, this type of arrangement becomes increasingly practicable—without causing everyone’s hours to change as they would by default under a change of the legal time. People for whom dark mornings would be a problem need not go to earlier hours. It would be appropriate for governments to try to generally encourage changes in hours where those changes have benefits in the particular circumstances, for example through tax incentives for seasonally varying opening hours, for flexible arrangements allowing hours chosen by the individual, or more directly for energy efficiency; and if needed a greater degree of coercion could be applied in wartime. I would consider the value of the honesty of being clear that the aim is to change working times, rather than hiding it behind changes of clocks, to out-weigh the advantages that may arise from such changes.

The strongest argument for doing away with Summer Time might however be that it could help deal with certain misconceptions that changes to the clocks can create “extra daylight”. Some years ago this idea came up in a Private Member’s Bill, the British Time (Extra Daylight) Bill of 1995–6 introduced by John Butterfill MP. While this attempt failed, it appeared that the idea that politicians could create extra daylight by legislating for it was unfortunately widespread.

SoupDragon · Post by **SoupDragon** » 19 Mar 2007, 18:50

Very informative Porty.
Can remember going to school with the armbands on ,68-72 according to your dates, though I thought it was only one year, but I was young and other things were more important

I hate getting used to the time change, wish they'd just leave it as is.

Have heard arguments about us and Europe all being in one time zone but the USA manages with different time zones so why can't we?

Poppy · Post by **Poppy** » 19 Mar 2007, 18:51

Where did you copy that from, Porty?

Post by **wangi** » 19 Mar 2007, 18:54

SoupDragon wrote:the USA manages with different time zones so why can't we?

Actually what you'll find in the US is the time they start work varies with each zone so in effect kinda making the time zone redundant. Well that's my experience.

arachnid · Post by **arachnid** » 19 Mar 2007, 18:55

Thanks Porty

ali · Post by **ali** » 19 Mar 2007, 19:17

Poppy wrote:Where did you copy that from, Porty?

What was it that made you suspicious?

Poppy · Post by **Poppy** » 19 Mar 2007, 19:22

ali wrote:
Poppy wrote:Where did you copy that from, Porty?
What was it that made you suspicious?

Spelling errors (or lack thereof

) and general style. And especially

(In February 2000 I requested a review of the extended closure period of the World War 2 summer time records, and in May the Home Office concluded that they could now be opened to the public.)

Hmmm!!

ali · Post by **ali** » 19 Mar 2007, 19:24

Poppy wrote:
ali wrote:
Poppy wrote:Where did you copy that from, Porty?
What was it that made you suspicious?
Spelling errors (or lack thereof ) and general style. And especially
(In February 2000 I requested a review of the extended closure period of the World War 2 summer time records, and in May the Home Office concluded that they could now be opened to the public.)
Hmmm!!

"Hmmm" right enough.

bearcub · Post by **bearcub** » 19 Mar 2007, 19:43

Poppy wrote:Where did you copy that from, Porty?

That was my 1st thought......followed closely by "Damn, I'm a Mod now, I've got to read the whole thing"

Poppy · Post by **Poppy** » 19 Mar 2007, 19:44

Here's a further quote from the source of Porty's piece which is strangely amusing and a bit bizarre!

None of the information provided here is official, and it should not be relied on for any purpose

Poppy · Post by **Poppy** » 19 Mar 2007, 19:46

bearcub wrote:
Poppy wrote:Where did you copy that from, Porty?
That was my 1st thought......followed closely by "Damn, I'm a Mod now, I've got to read the whole thing"

I know, BC! Awful, isn't it? See that Marya and Bellybabe? We'll get them back for this....one day!!

I dread Youtube links...although I do like Bob's latest link re "Joppa - A Sea View".

Porty · Post by **Porty** » 19 Mar 2007, 19:52

Whoah not claiming that's mine. I googled "British Summer Time History" and it came top. Don't know who wrote it? Sorry for keeping you all in the dark.

Poppy · Post by **Poppy** » 19 Mar 2007, 19:57

Porty wrote:Whoah not claiming that's mine. I googled "British Summer Time History" and it came top. Don't know who wrote it? Sorry for keeping you all in the dark.

Just taking the proverbial!! Here's the full text. Something to do with that hotbed of spies known as Cambridge 'Uni' or, worse, 'Vaaaasitty'

bellybabe · Post by **bellybabe** » 20 Mar 2007, 13:36

bearcub wrote:followed closely by "Damn, I'm a Mod now, I've got to read the whole thing"

I still think that.

mr magnolia · Post by **mr magnolia** » 22 Mar 2007, 22:32

I sped ( a rare experience) across the great motorway network of Scotland after work today and arrived in Portobello just after 7pm, in what I would call the first gloaming of the year. It was a wonderful evening.

I only associate the gloaming with summertime - it needs to last a measurable time; it needs to be warm(ish) and you need to hear birdsong. Oh, and someone must be roaming. Perhaps you also need to be measured in BST too, but this one snuck in early.

tom nimmo · Post by **tom nimmo** » 23 Mar 2007, 10:07

Had the present government been inclined to tamper with BST and give us an extra couple of hours of daylight I have no doubt that the Brownster would have taxed it stealthily and we would have ended up with a net loss of one hour in real terms.

Maria · Post by **Maria** » 24 Mar 2007, 18:42

Thought I'd add a reminder that the clocks go forward tomorrow morning at 1.00 a.m. That's one hour less in bed

Poppy · Post by **Poppy** » 24 Mar 2007, 18:59

Marya wrote:Thought I'd add a reminder that the clocks go forward tomorrow morning at 1.00 a.m. That's one hour less in bed

So remember to go to your Profile to change the time zone bit there....

Post by **wangi** » 24 Mar 2007, 19:14

Poppy wrote:So remember to go to your Profile to change the time zone bit there....

And just so I don't forget to do it for the whole site... I've just done it now. Better early than never!

SoupDragon · Post by **SoupDragon** » 24 Mar 2007, 19:55

Oh I wish we could just stay on GMT and not bother changing,
at least the computer changes itself, but I'll have to change the central heating, vcrs, dvds, microwave, wall clocks,alarm clocks, body clocks....

the clock in the car....

mobile phone....

AAaaaarrrrrgh

Poppy · Post by **Poppy** » 24 Mar 2007, 20:05

I had a trial run at my dad's today but because he has caller display the landline phones are automatically updated when the phone rings for the first time after 1 am

so he's got two sets of time to look at and get [even more] confused.

Chez Poppy, the clever VCR does itself

SoupDragon · Post by **SoupDragon** » 24 Mar 2007, 20:14

Some of our electricals might reset themselves.
But we have "wind up " alarms in case of power cuts, clocks the kids made at school etc etc.
So Mr Soupy and Clanger 2 have to get up an hour earlier to go to Stirling for karate stuff 2 moro. I'll wave goodbye from under the downie

Sandra · Post by **Sandra** » 24 Mar 2007, 21:49

I love that it will now be longer light at night